Appropriate Amplifier for Beyerdynamic DT990 PRO

[scorpion89]

Hi Guys,

I'm looking into getting a set of Beyerdynamic DT990 PRO headphones and am unsure which amplifier I should purchase for them.
I mainly will use it with my ps3 and PC mostly playing FPS but also other genres, so I need it to have a optical/ tosslink in port. I was looking at the Asus: Xonar Essence One. Would that be a appropriate choice? Chose that because its the only one I've found with a optical port that's under 500 bucks, and I love Asus products I've had so many devices from them (currently using a N55S for work and a VX7 lambo for portable gaming) and all have been as reliable as a wood burning stove! Love them!

Another thing I wanted to ask is does the Asus: Xonar Essence One offer any kind of surround sound support? Tried looking to see if it supported dolby headphone but every result I found was for the sound cards themselves not the external device. Gotta love how you ask Google for bananas so it gives you apples...... I wanted to try get something that supports either dolby headphone or CMSS-3D.

I was planing on setting it up by HDMI cable from ps3 or PC to TV, then optical cable from TV to amplifier, then headsets in the front audio jack. That way if I go through my TV I can control the volume through my TV remote instead of having to constantly get up to adjust the volume on the amp.

I'm also a little confused on whether the DT990 600 ohm versions are worth the extra money? Some posts I've read says the higher the impedance the better the soundstage, others say it makes no difference so which ones should I get?
I can get the DT 990 PRO 250 ohm for $250, where the 600 ohm are $350. Is the 600 ohm really worth the extra $100?
As I said above looking to spend around $800 in total, both amp and headphones.

Also I live in Sydney and have been trying to find a few local stores around me that have these both on display and for sale but can't find any. Any stores that offer trying around the Sydney CBD area?

Thanks for any advice given!

[Drubbing]

I think such a phone is overkill for PS3 and gaming use. You won't get anywhere near your moneys worth, and the extra cost of amping them, for gaming, really is pointless. That's before we even get onto getting your TV involved in the set up.

[Marcus]

If it's mainly for games from your PS3 and PC, spending more than about $200 is mad. An $800 headphone setup just isn't going to necessary unless you listen to a lot of decent music and have the source material to match.

Higher impedance headphones don't have better soundstage.

$800 for a DT990pro setup will give you ~$300 headphone sound quality for $800 outlay, and using it for games you'll probably get less than 1/4 of the performance that the setup will be capable of.

[scorpion89]

Before I start what's the difference between the PROs and the standard ones? Both are 250 ohm variants, so why is the standard edition $100 dollars more?

I know I 100% agree that spending $650 is wasteful just for audio in your games. But that said I need to purchase a amplifier with optical in and the cheapest one I found was the Asus. so what starts of as $250 expense turns into a $650 expense. $250 for headphones, $400 for Asus amp. So sadly what I previously posted is about as low as I'm going to find. Yea it's wasteful but what else should I go for then?

I was only looking at the DT990s because I emailed your tech support and they suggested the audio Technica AD900, which might I add is $300 on your site. I said no they have too little bass, so they recommended the DT 440s which a friend of mine has and I did not like them again too weak, so they suggested the 990s so here we are.

So if It's a waste me getting the DT990 PRO and the Asus Xonar Essance One amplifier for gaming then what should I get?

Today I was in the city researching and I tried a pair of Audio Technica A900X headphones. Again these sounded so good my ears melted. Great Bass, strong treble, beautiful tones. But there even more expensive than the DT990s I can get those for $250, where the A900X is around $300.
I also tried a pair of Sennheiser PC series out today not sure which ones they were, all I remember were they were cloth not leather and they were $443 and they sounded really poor for $200 let alone $300!..... let alone $443! Just goes to show 1 Sennheiser is SERIOUSLY overpriced! 2 More $$$ does not always mean better quality.

Persisting with the Asus Xonar Essance One does it support Dolby Headphone or CMSS-3D?

anyway to close off, if I'm not getting the Beyerdynamic DT990s then what should I get?

PS to put it down to it. Yea $650 is a allot, but that is coming from the guy who spent $350 bucks on the recent Turtlenbeach Earforce Deltas! Suffice to say the DT990s will sound allot more then twice as good, so if anything it's bargain of the century!

[BusinessEvolution]

Unfortunately I don't believe the Asus Essence One supports Dolby headphones at this stage, you would need a source that supports dolby headphones itself or dolby pro logicII/dolby surround which PS3 only sort of supports (from what I have read its not in all games). PS2 fully supported Dolby Pro Logic II lol.

"This unit only accepts two-channel LPCM digital audio (eg Dolby Digital 2.0). You can not connect a Dolby Digital 5.1 or a DTS signal as they will not be recognized. Please Ensure that the sound output of your player is set to two-channel PCM." From the Essence One manual.


I found Headphones with an excellent sound-stage + a dac with good separation better than Dolby headphones for actual gaming performance. Works wonders when a movie has dolby encoded audio and it can make games sound more dramatic but depends on what you are after. For exact positioning of footsteps and bullet fire, I prefer using my ASUS STX in HIFI mode.


It also depends what you want, if you got the A900X now, you could put off getting the ASUS essence one till later. The A900X benefits from amping but still sounds good without it. The likes of AD700/900 out perform dolby headphones with their excellent sound stages but as you already know they have less bass.

[scorpion89]

The Beyerdynamics have less bass? I thought the 990s were the bassist headphones you could get, allot heavier then the 900Xs! Well that's a bit of a problem then because the bass sounded decent on them at the store today, but nothing too crash hot definitely not what I would consider the bassist headset possible! For instance the Tritton AX PRO I had previously had oh my god WAY too much bass! It was like strapping a 1200W sub woofer to my head, it drove me insane! If that's true that the Audio Technica A900X has more bass then the beyerdynamic DT770 PRO and 990 PRO, then I think I've found which headset I want.

As for the locational audio to be honest I'm not really concerned with that. I don't play multiplayer so I have no need to be able to hear footsteps or which direction bullets are coming from, what I really need is to be able to notice all the sound effects and have decent bass. One thing I hate about allot of headsets is allot of the minor details are lost. For instance in uncharted 3 there is a really distinct clank sound when you reload magazines, when I had my Trittons they were so bass heavy I could not hear it it was like there were no sound effects for reloading. But then sold them and got the turtle beaches and I started noticing and relishing in all these sound effects I could not hear with the Trittons.
Only reason why I want to get the Asus is because its cheap, dirt cheap! Most DAC/amplifiers I have found are well over $400! As the others have stated it's overkill to spend this much on gaming headphones so I'm really trying to cut back on spending, and the xonar essance one is as cut back as you can get. Which is kinda ironic considering it outperforms some $1000 DACs!
Which is why I love Asus! Not only do they make awesome products, have awesome customer support, are extremely reliable, packaged very well, but they are extremely good value for money!

Does anyone know of any shops in Sydney where I could try these headphones out? I was in the city today as I said before but found 2 stores that was about it! I live near Parramatta so I've been looking for stores around there, Aurburn, all the way to the city and I have found maybe 3! Every one I find is in VIC for some reason, I swear to god if I find one more audio shop to find its in VIC my heads going to explode!
I just cant understand it. Hundreds of shops in Melbourne, just 1 suburb! But expand that 10 fold in NSW and your lucky to find 5!

Sorry one more thing, do you's offer price matching? Both the DT770 PRO and DT990 PRO are going for around $250 around the web, and the A900Xs are around $290. And the Amplifier I've seen it going for $400.

Thanks!

[BusinessEvolution]

I don't think I mentioned the Beyerdynamic headphones , I was only talking about the audio-technica headphones. The Beyerdynamic headphones you are talking about probably have a bit more base than the ATH-A900X from what I have read.

Though from my own usage the ATH-A900s have enough base for me, especially with the ASUS Essence stx which has a slightly darker sound signature with the default opamps. If you really like bass you can hardware tweek the Asus essence one to have slightly more base at the cost of a bit of detail, asus has published an opamp guide for their website.

[Drubbing]

As for the locational audio to be honest I'm not really concerned with that.

Then just buy some decent closed phones, like the M50, Koss TBSE1 etc

One thing I hate about allot of headsets is allot of the minor details are lost. For instance in uncharted 3 there is a really distinct clank sound when you reload magazines, when I had my Trittons they were so bass heavy I could not hear it it was like there were no sound effects for reloading. But then sold them and got the turtle beaches and I started noticing and relishing in all these sound effects I could not hear with the Trittons.

As above.

I'm really trying to cut back on spending, and the xonar essance one is as cut back as you can get. Which is kinda ironic considering it outperforms some $1000 DACs!

You've been reading too much. I highly doubt it does. Such claims are audio reviewing clichés.

Sorry one more thing, do you's offer price matching? Both the DT770 PRO and DT990 PRO are going for around $250 around the web, and the A900Xs are around $290. And the Amplifier I've seen it going for $400.

Thanks!

You're not going to get a local retailer price matching on overseas and online sources.

[BusinessEvolution]

As for the locational audio to be honest I'm not really concerned with that.

Then just buy some decent closed phones, like the M50, Koss TBSE1 etc

I'm really trying to cut back on spending, and the xonar essance one is as cut back as you can get. Which is kinda ironic considering it outperforms some $1000 DACs!

You've been reading too much. I highly doubt it does. Such claims are audio reviewing clichés.

You're not going to get a local retailer price matching on overseas and online sources.

Don't forget postage/warranty, on very high end headphones GST as well.

As for the ASUS essence one's performance, it depends what aspect you are talking about. Its upsampling filters and its USB connection do outperform some 1000-2000 dacs (or match them), but for overall sound quality the 1000 dac will probably win. The asus essence one wins on tweakability if you are interested in that, as it has 11 swappable opamps. At its price point its still a high value proposition.

[Marcus]

The A900X is essentially a cosmetically upgraded A900, it absolutely does not do bass anywhere near the level of the DT990/770 etc.
The only real differences between the DT990pro and DT990 are cosmetic.

Headphones that need amplification aren't better than headphones that need an amp, so "I'm getting an amp I may as well get headphones that need an amp" isn't a logical conclusion.

A model like the Beyer DT250 would likely have plenty of bass for your liking, even the AD900 might suit(seeing as you found the A900X had plenty of bass and they're far from what I'd consider bassy). AKG K242HD is another option, the list goes on.

Furthermore : "This product is normally $5000 but I can get it for $200" will NOT guarantee that you'll like what you get. Buy the product based on what you need, not how discounted you can find it. Case in point: all those people buying AKG K701s cheap expecting to be blown away and instead being very disappointed because they aren't a great choice for everyone.

We can't match overseas or unauthorised reseller pricing (there's a few in Australia) unfortunately.

[theeyealtering]

As for the ASUS essence one's performance, it depends what aspect you are talking about. Its upsampling filters and its USB connection do outperform some 1000-2000 dacs (or match them), but for overall sound quality the 1000 dac will probably win. The asus essence one wins on tweakability if you are interested in that, as it has 11 swappable opamps. At its price point its still a high value proposition.

I'm sure there are examples of companies pumping out relatively shitty DACs and amps, charging thousands of dollars and getting shills to recommend them in hi-fi magazines. Next to them the Essence One would look like a giant killer.

[Drubbing]

Headphones that need amplification aren't better than headphones that need an amp, so "I'm getting an amp I may as well get headphones that need an amp" isn't a logical conclusion.

Furthermore : "This product is normally $5000 but I can get it for $200" will NOT guarantee that you'll like what you get. Buy the product based on what you need, not how discounted you can find it.

AMEN...

[Benno1988]

According to some Beyerdynamic speil i read, the different between the "Pro" and the "Edition" versions is that one just has a higher clamping force designed for professional use...seems odd...

[Marcus]

Beyer's model numbers etc don't make a great deal of sense.

The DT990pro and DT770pro were around before the 990 and 770. Originally the 770 and 990 (which I think have been discontinued) were targeted toward the "consumer" market instead of the pro market. This meant they came with more fancy packaging (pro and studio models have quite plain packaging vs the silver/orange/blue consumer packaging), had some slight cosmetic changes and a slightly longer, less tight headband meaning the out of the box clamping force was lower. Lower clamping force also results in slightly less prominent bass response (which you can fix by flexing the headband inward instead of outward).

[scorpion89]

Everyone's told me if your using the DT770 or 990s you NEED a amplifier they are too inefficient to run without one which is why I have been persisting with one. Also I have owned many many many headphones and none of them have I been happy with without a amplifier. The Audio Technica ATH-ANC7b for instance as I say below sounded crap without one, but with one pretty good even with a cheap $50 amp.

It's really hard for me to say if I thought the A900X had enough bass or not. Simply because at the lounge in the city I purchased a pair of Audio Technica: ATH-ANC7b headphones about 2 years ago I think it was. There they sounded amazing but when I got them home and hooked them to my HIFI system they sounded crap. No where near as much bass or clarity that the shop had. Took them back to the shop and the owner said oh that's because we use amplifiers in our systems. So in short me saying the A900X sounded great there means nothing because who knows what they were using behind the cabinet to make them that way. What's to say the same thing as last time wont happen again? That's why I'm really trying to find a store where I can go in and try these things out, but to be honest I think I'd have better luck trying to raise the dead! As I said before every store I've been able to find here is in Melbourne, any Sydney ones are warehouses to ship out of only they don't offer demonstrations.

Just wondering would something like the denon avr-1706 be appropriate to use? There actually surprisingly cheap $300 and something lots of stores around me stock which was a shock!

As for pricing there not from overseas, didn't you read me say if I find one more store that is in Melbourne my heads going to explode?
Cheapest I've found the Asus amp is $400 from ARC in Parramatta free delivery or pick up I live 15 minutes away. Cheapest I've found the headphones is a little store in the city called Sound Devices I've been sending emails back and forward and he quoted me $260 free shipping for them.

But before I worry about pricing I really need to find a shop where I can try them on. There's a high end audio store I know of we bought our rotell processor from them, I'm going to go in there see if he can get any of these things in for me.
Oh BTW goes without saying, but if you do know of stores around Parramatta to the city that demo these things please do tell me!

Just found a site that has the Sennheiser HD 650 selling for $370 would they be a better bet then the DT990 PRO? Still iffy if I should choose a closed set over a open set. It's really hard for me to say because all the cans in my life have been closed so I have nothing to go on.

Thanks!